DG-280 rotor doesn’t turn predictability

[Rob Ram]

Hi,

I recently installed the Sadoun Power Tech’s DG-280 HH motor and cannot get it to turn predictability. I am using Technisat’s SkyStar 2 (SS2) PCI board with Technisat’s latest drivers (4.4.1) and a positioner console by MiBi; found in SS2DiSEqC110.zip.
Even though the SS2 card is only specified for DisEqC 1.0, it will generate DisEqc 1.2 commands to the motor. It is limited though, to 350 ma maximum; but, should work with the DG-280. Other users have claimed that the SS2 board does work with the Moteck SG-2100.

Test set up:

• I have a Channel Master coaxial power injector connected to the SS2 RF port to monitor the DisEqc commands. The device is a simple device using a choke to isolate the power from the RF. An oscilloscope is connected to the power end of the choke.
• A PC sound card scope is connected to the oscilloscope line output port and is used to capture single shot events. While not nearly as accurate, it does provide a useful capture capability, which otherwise is lacking on the “real scope”.

Some test results:

• Using an oscilloscope, I can verify that the correct DisEqc 1.2 code is being delivered to the SS2 RF “F” connector, but under no load conditions (no connection to the motor).
• The east west buttons on the DG-280 does work as expected.
• I have 50 feet of RG6 cable between the PC and motor, direct connection.
• The DG-280 will return to 0.0 (south) using the GoTo 0.0 command, but not consistently. Most of the time, a Goto 0 command is ignored.
• Goto –17.1, as an example, the motor did turn to its limit. It actually kissed the roof; but no damage done.
• With the motor connected, after the “E0” “Framing byte function”(Command from Master, No reply required, First transmission), the oscilloscope shows a positive spike (very short duration about 2 volts) at the SS2 end. The spike occurs just after the odd parity bit is sent. Possibly this spike is interrupting the command. When the DG-280 disconnected, the spike does not happen. There are other spikes that appear elsewhere in the command string, but not as repeatable as the “E0” spike.
• The SS2 generates a square wave 1 volt peak to peak at 22Khz for DisEqc commands; as measured with a good quality oscilloscope. The SS2 also generates the 12 and 18 voltages accurately, as measured with a digital volt meter.
• I do not have a normal FTA receiver. I wish I did to simplify the setup; but my wife will kill me if I buy any more satellite stuff

Several questions:

• Has anyone been able to drive the DG-280 motor with Technisat’s SkyStar 2 PCI card?
• Is there a schematic available for the DG-280. A direct connection to power the motor, rather then coaxial power, will ovoid power glitches; as may be the case in 6 above. This will be a big help if available.
• Any one know of a manufacture that makes a bi-directional line buffer for DisEqc 1.2 commands?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

[jcdenton12]

Are you still having the same problem?

I have SS2 and DG280 HH mount and had same problem until yesterday evening

then I found a solution and it works great now


If you haven´t solved it yet, tell me and I´ll try to help you

[Muad'Dib]

Use DVBViewer or AlDVB!!!

[Rob Ram]

Originally Posted by jcdenton12

Are you still having the same problem?

I have SS2 and DG280 HH mount and had same problem until yesterday evening

then I found a solution and it works great now


If you haven´t solved it yet, tell me and I´ll try to help you

Thanks jcdenton12 for the reply. Yes I still have the problem, any help will be appreciated. Also I did purchase a Mercury II FTA receiver, mainly for setup use. It does work better then the PCI card, but still have problems getting the DG-280 to turn. Many times the receiver indicates that the motor is turning but a visual check on the dish position proves otherwise.

I a day or so (weather dependent), I plan to bring the DG-280 down off the roof and rip it open to modify the circuit board. The modification will power both the circuit board and motor from an external power supply. The receiver Diseqc commands will control the motor as before. At the least, this will prevent potential damage to the Technisat Sky Star 2 PCI card.

To "Muad'Dib". I am using DvbViewer Pro Version 3.9.2.0. I suspect once I get the DG-280 running ok, the PC positioner will also work ok.

[Muad'Dib]

Just try with Altdvb or DVBDream too, it cannot hurt.

[plastik]

I am having exactly the same problem with my HH, but with a Dreambox receiver (dm600pvr). Sometimes my motor ignores my commands (most of the time). I took the motor in and attached it to a very short cable (1m) for testing. The result was the same.
I wonder what is the solution mentioned by jcdenton12 a few posts before.

[Muad'Dib]

RESET your motor.

[bali]

Originally Posted by Muad'Dib

RESET your motor.

please tell me how to reset my DG-280

i am having some problems too


thanks

[Muad'Dib]

There is no reset button on the motor itself??

[Rob Ram]

Originally Posted by plastik

I am having exactly the same problem with my HH, but with a Dreambox receiver (dm600pvr). Sometimes my motor ignores my commands (most of the time). I took the motor in and attached it to a very short cable (1m) for testing. The result was the same.
I wonder what is the solution mentioned by jcdenton12 a few posts before.

The solution mentioned was in reference to the computer power supply. You may want to check your computer power supply. Measure the voltages and verify that they are in spec. An overloaded PC power supply can create problems. Also if you have an oscilloscope, look at the noise on the various voltage output sources. However, this was not the problem in my case.
I haven't finished Spice circuit simulation of the internal CPU board, but the problem seems to be a design problem when the DisEqc 1.2 motor positioner control signal is slightly low in amplitude. I did successfully modify the DG280 to be powered from an external power supply, however the Technisat SkyStar PCI card still could not control the DG280, yet it does correctly control DisEqc type switches. By contrast the motor operated correctly when controlled from a Mercury II receiver with the external power supply modification. The main difference between the Mercury II and the Technisat SkyStar PCI card is a slight difference in the DisEqc 1.2 control signal amplitude, where the Mercury II is the greater amplitude.

[jcdenton12]

well, the solution actually does not exist

I use MiBi´s plugin
SS2DiseqC.exe, but it also does not work every time
when I wrote my previous post, it was just a luck that it worked

so if you work yout anything I will be glad too

sorry

[danhux]

I have the same problem. I'm using a new Viewsat Ultra, the dish and motor are only 30 feet away.. Motor doesn't behave.. worked for a day. Help somebody please

[jcdenton12]

I think, I got it working

It turns with my SkyStar2 2.6d and Technisat 4.4.1 drivers
it work even with another versions, but I didn´t like them.

so I´ll try write some guide to help you

1.I hope your motor is mounted correctly, facing your "reference" satellite

for example my longitude is 21.2, so my reference satellite is Astra 19.2°E with motor turned 3.2° to the west (doesn´t look great, since it is not 100% accurate, but it works)

try to find satellite with the strongest signal you can, that is the best option for setting up motor

2. download MiBi SS2DiseqC 1.10 (you can google it or use this http://www.dvbskystar.com/download/click.php?id=432)
click on the configuration button

in type, select Stab HH 1x0
use google earth or anything else to find out your lattitude and longitude
don´t exchange these values, because it wouldn´t work
click apply and put transponders from your player (drag the directory with transponders to SS2DiseqC 1.10 window, to the white space in the upper half)

3. select the satellite you are facing
check if you are really facing that satellite in some player, if yes, then click auto GoTo x.x°

it will generate everything needed for turning, mainly RAW diseqC commands

I think that for now, the "guide" should be the same for everybody (card doesn´t matter)

for my SS2 now I select satellite I want to drive to and click Send
most of the time it works as it should, but sometimes it doesn´t move, even when program shows progress

the solution, "drive back" to position you are at (just to let program know, that you are on the satellite, you are really at)
and now click Max Signal
this works for me everytime, when everything else fails
dish will start to move by about 0.4° in one step
go outside and see if it is moving

if yes, you got it working
the program will find transponder with the strongest signal and will tray to tune it to the max possible
now you can save new position or simply cancel, doesn´t really matter

when you now choose another satellite and click send, dish should be moving


if you have cards that doesn´t work with MiBi SS2DiseqC than use SS2DiseqC to generate RAW DiseqC commands and copy and paste them to your favourite player


so I hope it helps somebody
if anything is unclear, write and I´ll do my best to explain it better

[SkyPilot]

Reset instructions should be available in the PDF that is on the Sadoun sales site with the motor, but I believe it involves removing power from the motor, pressing both the East/West buttons and holding them for 5 seconds.

Click here for User's Manual: http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Products/P...ser_Manual.pdf

[jdbob]

I've had problems from the beginning with my DG-280 motor. I started out with a Mercury II and it would work about half the time. Just got a Viewsat MaxHD and it works even less frequently.

Getting tempted to take the motor apart and look at the signals to see if I can see the problem.

Only about 25' feet of RG6 cable, only about 1.5 ohms total resistance in the cable run.

[Jim-S]

Hi...........I had problems with my DG-240, I thought, after much agravation and testing I replaced the Universal LNB. and that was my problem. After one year now I have upgraded to an LPN-031.
Jim

[jdbob]

Hi Jim,

I had previously tried it without the LNB connected (I have a QPH-031) and it didn't make difference on my system.

Took the motor apart and inspected it and everything seemed to be OK as far as signals go. In fact it worked fine on the workbench but went back to erratic operation once it was put back outside.

Did find out what "moving time" in the Viewsat MaxHD USALS menu does though. During that time (in seconds) it puts the voltage up to 18V regardless of what will be required (V vs H) for the satellite. I guess this intended to make sure there is plenty of voltage for moving.

Of course the problem is that the motor usually doesn't receive the command when first sent. Or maybe it gets the signal and then chokes for some reason.

[Jim-S]

Originally Posted by jdbob

Hi Jim,

I had previously tried it without the LNB connected (I have a QPH-031) and it didn't make difference on my system.

Took the motor apart and inspected it and everything seemed to be OK as far as signals go. In fact it worked fine on the workbench but went back to erratic operation once it was put back outside.

Did find out what "moving time" in the Viewsat MaxHD USALS menu does though. During that time (in seconds) it puts the voltage up to 18V regardless of what will be required (V vs H) for the satellite. I guess this intended to make sure there is plenty of voltage for moving.

Of course the problem is that the motor usually doesn't receive the command when first sent. Or maybe it gets the signal and then chokes for some reason.

If I remember you put this system together recently, so did I. I had a little problem at first when I installed the LPN-031. It seemed to move after a few seconds or it didn't move but mine worked find without the 22khz switch in place. Then I was advised to put the Circular signal to the "ON" side of the switch and Linear to the "OFF" side of the switch. It has been working fine, I do have one problem, if I leave the receiver on, lets say over night with the NASA (Circular) on, when I turn the TV on and try to do any thing with the receiver it is frozen and then it like recycles turns off then on. So now I shut off the receiver when not in use. Seem to be working fine now...............just food for thought.
Jim

[jdbob]

Yeah, I tried that too (moving circular to 22KHz ON), and if anything it might have made it worse. I guess that just goes to show how marginal these systems are.

Today I replaced the Leviton RG6/U that came with the kit with some Belden 1694A I had left over from a satellite internet system I installed 5 years ago. That seemed to help a little.

Then continuing with the "just try stuff" method, I replaced the 22khz switch that came with Merc with the DISEqC switch that came with the Viewsat and now it seems to work much better. Might even be 100% but too early to tell.

The Viewsat puts out a nice HD picture but they still have some software glitches to work out. Like, for instance, it seems impossible to permanently delete channels, they keep coming back at the end of the list!

[Jim-S]

Originally Posted by jdbob

Yeah, I tried that too (moving circular to 22KHz ON), and if anything it might have made it worse. I guess that just goes to show how marginal these systems are.

Today I replaced the Leviton RG6/U that came with the kit with some Belden 1694A I had left over from a satellite internet system I installed 5 years ago. That seemed to help a little.

Then continuing with the "just try stuff" method, I replaced the 22khz switch that came with Merc with the DISEqC switch that came with the Viewsat and now it seems to work much better. Might even be 100% but too early to tell.

The Viewsat puts out a nice HD picture but they still have some software glitches to work out. Like, for instance, it seems impossible to permanently delete channels, they keep coming back at the end of the list!

I have heard that these 22khz switches are very delicate and not to do any work on them without turning off your receiver and or unplugging the receiver so as not to damage the switch.
I wish you good luck..............

[jdbob]

Originally Posted by Jim-S

I have heard that these 22khz switches are very delicate and not to do any work on them without turning off your receiver and or unplugging the receiver so as not to damage the switch.
I wish you good luck..............

Proper engineering costs money....

I'd say I'm getting at least 95% reliability as far as the dish moving at this point. The remaining annoyance is sometimes after a move the Viewsat doesn't find the transponder, moving to another transponder and back again shows it really is there. Haven't investigated the cause further.

[KOSMO]

Not looking forward to opening windows in the wintertime to see/hear if my dish is moving I tried something else.

I have had a Mercury 2 limping along for a few months now since my purchase. Yes the mercury has many F/W problems. But I CANNOT STRESS ENOUGH the best thing you can do if you dish won't always move when the merc says it is. RESET THE HH MOTOR!!!!! Command the dish to zero. (not sure that is necessary. Then go outside and press and hold BOTH the EAST and WEST pushbuttons for 5 seconds. (Dish should not move while doing this)

The difference was so incredible I am sure that I corrected a problem.

I had been playing with so many things Diseqc USALS etc and then doing factory resets on the receiver. Didn't know that the HH motor actually stores things too!!!!!

[SkyPilot]

The Ecoda 22KHz is the most reliable on the market.

As for 4x1 switches, use a quality brand like EMP or Chieta.

I've been using a Chieta HD 4x1 outdoors for my Invacom Quad LNB and haven't had any problems with it.

The 4x1 switches that come with most STB's are of low quality and prone to failure.

I also use an Ecoda 22KHz switch in my setup and the Ecoda has a reputation as being the best 22KHz switch on the market.

Spend a few extra bucks for quality switches, waterproof compression connectors and properly ground your system and it should perform flawlessly.

And as mentioned above, unplug your STB before connecting/disconnecting anything to/from it as the static charge can damage electrical equipment like switches and LNB's.