Quick SG2100 question - Page 2

DruzeTito · #31 (**permalink**) 02-27-2004, 07:19 PM

incredible... i do not know what the problem is. Get echostar sats excellently. Just nothing with my other main lnb. It doesnt make sense to me at all. One transponder that I was getting 33% on G10R when I was fixed is now 0 % when its at g10r.

Can you just make sure that I mounted the whole thing right? I have the pole mount 90cm and the motor's mounting tube is pointing to the ground, because i have seen other setups with the tubes pointing up.

dtsexpert · #32 (**permalink**) 02-27-2004, 11:33 PM

SG2100 shaft points down. That's correct. No supprise too me when you can lock on circular but not linear. DishNet signal is very strong. If you mount is on a 90cm dish, you can move the dish few deg up/down left/right still manage to get lock.
As I have set, do not trust the dish elevation scale, besides moving the whole thing left/right, you do need to adjust thedish eleveation up/down to get lock.
Don't touch the mount elevation.
I can confirm that mounting the circular lnbf next to the linear one does not affect the signal strength/quality of the linear. I once mounted 2 circular lnbf next the linear, all 3 lnbf work fine.
Since you can't see your true south, how do you know your dish is set at truesouth right? That's why I have said forget about aiming the dish at true south first. Use USALS to move the dish to T5, then move the whole thing left/right and adjust the dish elevation up/down trying to get lock on T5. Once you get lock on T5, you will get the other sats.
Michael

Quote:

Originally Posted by DruzeTito

incredible... i do not know what the problem is. Get echostar sats excellently. Just nothing with my other main lnb. It doesnt make sense to me at all. One transponder that I was getting 33% on G10R when I was fixed is now 0 % when its at g10r.

Can you just make sure that I mounted the whole thing right? I have the pole mount 90cm and the motor's mounting tube is pointing to the ground, because i have seen other setups with the tubes pointing up.

DruzeTito · #33 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 01:59 AM

Ok so the dish net signals is very strong. But im still not far away from that arc.

Now let me say that, I THINK I can see my true south and the mast already points that way i believe. I took a look at the compass, again has many variation depends on where I put it. When I held it straight and level in my hand pointing exactly where the mast was, it was just about right on 190-193. Which is the Tsouth.

Now, I have heard you say numberous times "don't touch the mount elevation." I am wondering as to why not, because I tried to PERFECTLY set that pointy little triangle to 40, and my lat is 40.59 so; I dont know; you think .6 makes a difference?

When I had it set to 40, and the mast set to about Tsouth, I was able to get 84 signal on one T5 transponder but no quality at all. It was very frustrating. I move the dish as SLOWLY as I can for it's declination but still not those beautiful green bars. This is when I USALSed it to T5 from 0 position. LNB almost perfect 0.

So next since declination didn't do anything, I returned it to where it had the strongest signal and worked on moving the mast extremely slowly left and right. The mast was parallel to my house, and of course i didn't have to worry about the dish hitting the house because it was pointing to T5. But my signal lowered, so I tried to go to the right, but signal got lower, so I returned it to the Tsouth point at again which i believe I measured accuratley with the compass; and that point seemed to have strongest signal. I wish that the SBS 6 transponder 11730 H 4880 3/4 was strong because it would probably make it easier to start at Tsouth sat, but I tried the numerous adjustments and i got 50-55 signal, not good at all, and plus evergreen branches are right in the way about 50-100 feet away. What I KNOW is that I have peeked at T5 through the branches and got really good signal quality when I was fixed.

Also at times the signals will drastically fluctuate, going from 33, 55, 70 and back again.

I think the elevation of my dish confuses me the most. The red line seems to point lower than the dish really is. Looks like right behind the screw is the position where it is pointing. I remember when I had it fixed on G10R and it was supposed to be 22 elevation according to calculations
but I got the actual signal when the red line was at about 19-20. And the back of the screw sure looked like it was at 22-23. At first I thought it was the pole but I remeasured and it turned out fine. I dunno.

So what do you think? I have a whole saturday ahead of me and I will try to adjust more and if that is no good than maybe ill just take down the whole damn thing and start all the way back to remeasuring the pole. I might try to get an inclinometer in case my little balance tool is not working good. Again, thank you so much for reading these painfully long posts and helping me but I believe that this thread might be useful to other people in the future.

dtsexpert · #34 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 04:58 AM

Here is the good news: I will have a whole Saturday free as well, so feel free to post the quetions here anytime you like. I check this forum very often, especially on Sat, since I spend most of the time watching satellite feeds, chatting with other sat hobbiests on weekend.
I am also using MSN Messenger, let me know if you want to chat. I will help you out, do not panic....:-)
Now, back to the problem. Here is what I think:
1. Signal strength does not tell anything. Plus, you really don't know if the "strong" signal strenght you got is actually from T5 since we do not know if the dish elevation is accurate.
2. Unless you are very lucky, you will get lock on T5 without adjusting the dish elevation. Let me tell you my experiences when helping a customer who bought a system here to install the Stab 100 mount. The dish elevation scale is WAY off. In my location, in theory the dish elevation needs to be set at 26, in reality we have the set the dish at 19 to get lock on truesouth and the rest of the satellites. That's why I have said many times, do not trust the dish elevation. You have to do some adjustment for the dish elevation. Reading your posts, I don't see you mentioned anything about dish elevation adjustment, so if you have not done that, try to adjust the dish up/dow few degs.
I beleive the problem you can't get lock on T5 is either the dish is high or low.
I do feel your frustration. I took me almost a week to set up my first h-h mount, so you re not alone...:-)
In fact, you do some reading before doing the installation and you understand the concept of how the h-h mount works, which is way much better than I was when I set up my first system...:-)
I hope you will get the dish going tomorow.
Michael

Quote:

Originally Posted by DruzeTito

Ok so the dish net signals is very strong. But im still not far away from that arc.

Now let me say that, I THINK I can see my true south and the mast already points that way i believe. I took a look at the compass, again has many variation depends on where I put it. When I held it straight and level in my hand pointing exactly where the mast was, it was just about right on 190-193. Which is the Tsouth.

Now, I have heard you say numberous times "don't touch the mount elevation." I am wondering as to why not, because I tried to PERFECTLY set that pointy little triangle to 40, and my lat is 40.59 so; I dont know; you think .6 makes a difference?

When I had it set to 40, and the mast set to about Tsouth, I was able to get 84 signal on one T5 transponder but no quality at all. It was very frustrating. I move the dish as SLOWLY as I can for it's declination but still not those beautiful green bars. This is when I USALSed it to T5 from 0 position. LNB almost perfect 0.

So next since declination didn't do anything, I returned it to where it had the strongest signal and worked on moving the mast extremely slowly left and right. The mast was parallel to my house, and of course i didn't have to worry about the dish hitting the house because it was pointing to T5. But my signal lowered, so I tried to go to the right, but signal got lower, so I returned it to the Tsouth point at again which i believe I measured accuratley with the compass; and that point seemed to have strongest signal. I wish that the SBS 6 transponder 11730 H 4880 3/4 was strong because it would probably make it easier to start at Tsouth sat, but I tried the numerous adjustments and i got 50-55 signal, not good at all, and plus evergreen branches are right in the way about 50-100 feet away. What I KNOW is that I have peeked at T5 through the branches and got really good signal quality when I was fixed.

Also at times the signals will drastically fluctuate, going from 33, 55, 70 and back again.

I think the elevation of my dish confuses me the most. The red line seems to point lower than the dish really is. Looks like right behind the screw is the position where it is pointing. I remember when I had it fixed on G10R and it was supposed to be 22 elevation according to calculations
but I got the actual signal when the red line was at about 19-20. And the back of the screw sure looked like it was at 22-23. At first I thought it was the pole but I remeasured and it turned out fine. I dunno.

So what do you think? I have a whole saturday ahead of me and I will try to adjust more and if that is no good than maybe ill just take down the whole darn thing and start all the way back to remeasuring the pole. I might try to get an inclinometer in case my little balance tool is not working good. Again, thank you so much for reading these painfully long posts and helping me but I believe that this thread might be useful to other people in the future.

DruzeTito · #35 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 04:03 PM

Well at this point I don't know what the problem is. I am getting lousy and erratic signals strengths from many tps on T5. I am aware of how the HH motor works, and I have read a ton before I got the motor. I did numberous and numbers DE adjustments, even really high , really low, slowly slowly, but nothing... I am not losing patience but my family is.. they want to watch the international channels and keep on saying forget it just put it back like it was. fixed. No way I say!! The next thing i will do is just totally take it down and start from step 1. Before I do that would it help you if I took some close up pictures of my setup?

dtsexpert · #36 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 04:24 PM

Take some pictures and post them here. I'll take a look at them.
Michael

Quote:

Originally Posted by DruzeTito

Well at this point I don't know what the problem is. I am getting lousy and erratic signals strengths from many tps on T5. I am aware of how the HH motor works, and I have read a ton before I got the motor. I did numberous and numbers DE adjustments, even really high , really low, slowly slowly, but nothing... I am not losing patience but my family is.. they want to watch the international channels and keep on saying forget it just put it back like it was. fixed. No way I say!! The next thing i will do is just totally take it down and start from step 1. Before I do that would it help you if I took some close up pictures of my setup?

DruzeTito · #37 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 04:42 PM

pointing to T5

huge tree in the way

dtsexpert · #38 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 05:12 PM

I think I found the problem. You did not install the lnbf holder correctly. The arm has to be inside of the holder. This simple mistake cause the both lnbfs way too low from the focal length.
Don't give up. Installing the holder correctly, I am sure you will find the signal.
Michael

Quote:

Originally Posted by DruzeTito

pointing to T5

huge tree in the way

bobkat · #39 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 05:27 PM

Yes, I agree with Michael. There is something really whacky about that LNB bracket. It almost looks like its mounted upside down. The feedhorn cover (white part) is way too close to the arm and the offset angle looks too high.

kat

DruzeTito · #40 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 05:38 PM

well that is good news, but now how do I fix it? There is a part on Sadoun's website that says the position the LNB as far away from the dish as possible?

dtsexpert · #41 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 05:56 PM

Bob and I are not talking about the lnbf position. You did not install the lnbf holder correctly. The arm has to be inside of the holder, other words, slide the holder into the arm.
Micheal

Quote:

Originally Posted by DruzeTito

well that is good news, but now how do I fix it? There is a part on Sadoun's website that says the position the LNB as far away from the dish as possible?

DruzeTito · #42 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 07:12 PM

I cant believe it... this cant be happening.

I saw the problem with the bracket, you were right I put it in the way it is, I took out the whole motor, replumed the pole.. exactly adjust the latitude, neutral lnb, pointed the mount to true south, adjusted DE extremely slowly to get signal on T5, also moved left right the whole mount. Nothing.. still nothing. There is a serious problem here and I don't know where it is. Are you guys positive the 2 lnb is not conflicting with the VH lnb? I cant believe this now I am getting impatient and frustrated I am running out of ideas.

I still have to try directly connecting the lnb to the motor... I previously did that though, but not with my setup version #2 (with bracket fixed) why did this have to be me with the problems? Have about reseting the whole receiver?

bobkat · #43 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 07:56 PM

The other LNB will have no adverse affects on the linear LNB - that is not the problem. I'm convinced that LNB holder is mounted incorrectly -- did you have to modify it in any way -- ie: drill a hole through the plastic? Michael is correct in that the holder should slide over the metal arm and then the bolt goes through the LNB bracket and then through the arm and back out the other side of the bracket and is secured by a nut.

Can you possibly take another really closeup shot of the bracket and arm and post it?

kat

DruzeTito · #44 (**permalink**) 02-28-2004, 08:03 PM

I think I did reposition the lnb bracket the way It should, I am working on some things now. Positioning the pole mount on the motor is confusing me.

DruzeTito · #45 (**permalink**) 02-29-2004, 01:49 AM

OK YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS SSSSSSSSSSSS

I did manage to get good signals on T5 and G10R!!!!!! Turns out that my Tsouth is almost parallel to my house, and when I moved the mount there, it sprang alive! What happened was I would fix one thing but screw up another and until i got everything perfect it would not work! But I am so far 90 percennt happy.

Obviously other problems are arising. After surfing between T5, E7, E6/8, and G10r satellites, it looks like something screwd up again and lost signal on T5 and G10R. Almost as though the more I move the motor the worse tthe signal gets. But that is maybe because I didnt try to peak the signal and I didnt even tighten everything so nothing is finalized yet.

Also, when I USALS to the circulars like Echo 7, I have to manual move with Disc 1.2 and get a lock. I goto STORE, and it looks as though the receiver isn't storing it(dvb 786v3) And it happens when I turn to another sat, then back, and its not stored at that particular position. Any fix?

Thank alot guys for guiding me in the right directions and spotting the error in the LNB bracket.

dtsexpert · #46 (**permalink**) 02-29-2004, 04:29 AM

" Also, when I USALS to the circulars like Echo 7, I have to manual move with Disc 1.2 and get a lock. I goto STORE, and it looks as though the receiver isn't storing it(dvb 786v3) And it happens when I turn to another sat, then back, and its not stored at that particular position. Any fix? "

I beleive that's a bug of 786v3 model. In order to make the receiver save 1.2 position, you have to scan some channels in. It's kind of weird, but not a big deal.
Glad you make the mount work. In case the USALS miss the sats just a little bit, you can set back to 1.2, nudge the dish and save the sat in 1.2. In theory, if everything is set correctly, 1.3 will not miss any viewable sats in your location.
Enjoy surfing the sky.
Michael

DruzeTito · #47 (**permalink**) 02-29-2004, 02:21 PM

Ok I got my signal back, I usals it to G10R, and tried to peak the signal but I got max 83 signal 100 quality on TP 11920... I used to get 86/100 when I was fixed. In fact yesterday the first time I got it with the mount it was 86/100. I tried moving DE and mount left/right but that is still the max. It is a bit lower when I go on T5: about 80/97 . Have any ideas on how to get back the signal I had?

dtsexpert · #48 (**permalink**) 02-29-2004, 03:27 PM

80/97 is very good. As long as the picture/sound are OK, you are fine. I get arround 82/86 for my truesouth, the dish tracks the arc perfectly. Signal strenght and quality are vary from one transponder to the others. Don't be too perfect. Try to program all the sats in to see how good the dish tracks to arc. If you miss some sats, we'll start from there.
Michael

Quote:

Originally Posted by DruzeTito

Ok I got my signal back, I usals it to G10R, and tried to peak the signal but I got max 83 signal 100 quality on TP 11920... I used to get 86/100 when I was fixed. In fact yesterday the first time I got it with the mount it was 86/100. I tried moving DE and mount left/right but that is still the max. It is a bit lower when I go on T5: about 80/97 . Have any ideas on how to get back the signal I had?