How to get signal on 10' BUD for C-Band?

[lagrange2009]

Hi Folks,

I already have a 90cm Fortec installed for Ku band. Now I am trying my luck at pointing a 10' BUD for C-Band. I am using a Toshiba TRX-1520 to move the actuator only, and have the C-Band coax hooked up to a Coolsat 6000 with a small TV at the dish for immediate audio and visual signal read while moving the dish around.

I found the Ku cable is disconnected, so I know I am hooked up to the C-Band cable...and the Coolsat shows 77% or so for all C-band sats and transponders...but no quality. My goal is to use it only for SatMex5 (116.8W) sat, so it will be stationary once I find the signal. I am just surprised that I am not picking up any signal on any C-band sat yet.

Questions:
- Do I have to skew the lnbf? I took off the cover, and there are no markings for skewing.
-Do I have to change the elevation of the lnbf (the distance between the dish center and lnbf)? It's currently set at 42. As the dish was working at another location in Northern CA, I thought I would not have to change this.
-Is it harder to find a signal on 10ft C-Band dish, compared to 90cm Ku Dish?? That 90cm dish was some work, but not impossible, like this seems to be. I am curious to the difficulty comparison between the two.

Per dishpointer.com I was told to point to 160 degrees (compass). I am doing that, and going back and forth 30 degrees (130-190), then hit the actuator one tick EAST, dropping the dish slightly, and moving the dish back and forth again. Nothing. There is no signal movement at all...stays at 77%...removing the cable drops it to 20%, so I know I'm on the lnbf.

So I will confirm right now that I am looking for an active transponder and will try some more. I am sure I move the actuator enough to a point where I am too low and too high in the sky, yet nothing inbetween. any help is greatly appreciated.

[lagrange2009]

I mentioned 'elevation' in the original post. I was mixing terms. I looked at the lnbf again, and see that it has markings on it, so the installer can recede the lnbf into the holder. The marks go from 30 to 42, so I will leave it at 42 where it was originally. Ignore the elevation comment.
Thanks!
lagrange

[BYX]

Originally Posted by lagrange2009

I mentioned 'elevation' in the original post. I was mixing terms. I looked at the lnbf again, and see that it has markings on it, so the installer can recede the lnbf into the holder. The marks go from 30 to 42, so I will leave it at 42 where it was originally. Ignore the elevation comment.
Thanks!
lagrange

If you truly have an LNBF make sure to park the antenna at your true south and set for 0° SKEW.
Make sure the focal distance is correct.
And most important of all make sure you have the correct frequency.
C band is very forgiving in comparison to Ku.
You should get signal very quick.
If you have an old LNB with corrotor for polarity, I may become very cumbersome to work with it.
You better get an LNBF.

[lagrange2009]

Okay...update for ya. I have the old style lnb so I don't think it's an "lnbf". This one has the red-white-black wires to switch the polarity from the box. I guess this is how it changes from H to V and vis-versa. I will hook up the Toshiba TRX-1520 to the TV, so I can visually see if I can change the polarity to the correct transponder setting that I am testing with.

This will not help me in the longrun as I want to still use my Coolsat 6000. I read on another post (from 6/4/2009) that I would want to buy GeaoSat Pro C KU Band Prime Focus LNBF. This way I can watch C and Ku channels from the Coolsat box, and I can leave the lnb set to "ON" and not "18v" or "13v". I'll look into buying this to solve the problem, but I think I should still be able to find a signal now.
Thanks for any replies to original post.

[lagrange2009]

Thanks BYX! I came back to this website, because you guys are always so knowledgeable and reply quickly. Per my last comment, turns out I have the old school lnb. Looks like I need to buy the lnbf afterall. I'll put it at 0 SKEW facing due south. It's good to know that the C-Band is more forgiving than Ku Band!

[pmb1010]

Since you have an analog receiver hooked up - it might be much easier to hunt for the remaining 2 or 3 analog C band stations that are in the clear to see if your dish is aimed right.

Then you'll know at least you are on the arc.
There should be ARTS, and a couple religious stations still on analog.
But since I haven't had a C band dish up for a while since my HH180 motor broke in half - maybe one of the other guys still on C band will chime in.

As far as the Geosat - yes you will use the FTA receiver to electronically switch H and V - it uses the 13 and 18v to do that.
The "power" to LNBF is normally always set to "on" so thats a set it and forget it.

You might want to investigate getting a Vbox to move your dish.
Theres nothing wrong with what you are doing but the Vbox is a cleaner method when you move to an all digital FTA setup controlling a big dish.

Good luck .
Let us all know how you progress. We all like to read posts good and bad results.

[lagrange2009]

Thanks PMB. That analog receiver is not user friendly at all so I'll probably wait. I ordered the new lnbf and will look into the vbox. I'll update this thread when progess is made.

[pmb1010]

Sadoun Powertech GBOX V3000 Positioner DiSEqC 1.2 Compatible
" http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Products/P...OX_VBOXIII.htm "

[lagrange2009]

Hello folks,

Well we have success. I bought the LNBF for C/Ku band. Installed it and scanned the skies. I found channels pretty quick. As I plan to have the dish stationary, I didn't worry too much about true south, except to set the skew to 0 degrees during install. I agree 10ft C band dish is more forgiving than the 90cm Ku dish.

One small problem. This is a good one for other newbies. The signal was lost when I ran it through my Diseqc splitter. Maybe my splitter is for Ku band only? I see Sadoun sells splitters for both C/Ku band. I should be able to buy one of those to run both the Ku dish and C dish though the same cable.

Thanks for the help and I hope this post helps others with their install.
Cheers,
lagrange2009

[pmb1010]

Splitter? What model device are you using to "split" the signal?

You need to use Diseqc switching device to have the reciever change from C to KU electronically.
Sadoun DiSEqC Switch 2-Way DS21C 1.0,2.0

There is a port 1 and port 2 (or A and B) and you use jumper cables to go from C port of LNBF to Port 1 and Ku port of LNBF to Port 2 of the switch.

Then the single cable comes from "center" back to receiver.

When you pick port 1 on the receivers settings you'll see C band.
Port 2 gives you Ku band.

WHat I did was create 2 satelltes for each Sat position (if the sat had C and KU)
Example
97W-C with Port 1 active for C band
97W-K with Port 2 active for Ku band

Scan each separately and you'll get 2 sets of channels.

Hope this helps.

[lagrange2009]

Pmb1010,

Yeah, I have this Coolsat 4x1 DiSeqc1.2 switcher? Maybe it's not called a splitter. It has inputs for LNB1,LNB2,LNB3,LNB4 and an output for receiver. The c-band will not go through this.

I'll try to understand what you wrote and apply it. My goal is simple. Just to get the Ku dish and C dish to feed to the receiver through one cable. I'll try what you mentioned and report back.

Thanks.

[lagrange2009]

PMB,
I looked at the 2-way Diseq switch you mentioned. I already have basically the same thing but in a 4-way switch. Maybe because this is a Coolsat switch that came with the receiver it was only designed for Ku band. The coolsat 6000 allows me to point to the correct Port for each SAT, (C and Ku Sats). So I did have the C-band Sat on the correct port (the cable connected to this port goes to C-band dish). Yet...the signal is lost when using switch. I bypassed the switch and the signal is strong. So this 4-way switch may be Ku band only. Are there switches for Ku only? This could be my problem.

[pmb1010]

Does the Coolsat switch have any freqs written on it?
(ie) 10600 - 14000 ?

C band is around 5150
Ku is around 10 to 12000

I've not heard of a DISEQC not passing C band freqs but I guess anythings possible.

[lagrange2009]

Here's what is says on the switch:

Frequency Range: 950-2400 MHz

This works fine with the Ku band Sat. I will check again to confirm the receiver is pointing to the correct Port for C-band sat. I swear I checked this a few times, but I'll check again.

[pmb1010]

That should be fine.
I'd do some troubleshooting - if you say you can get a c band signal direct (with no switch) I'd make sure the port you are working with on the 4 way switch is still good.

These switches are very prone to failure.
If you find that Port 2 works on Ku, change all the settings in the receiver and cables around to put C band on port 2 and see if it works.

If it doesn't - you know it's settings in the receiver - not the switch.

Make sure you power everything down before connecting/disconnecting these Diseqc switches. They seem to burn out very easily..

By the way:

5150 Local Oscillator freq mixes with the C band freqs of 3700 to 4200 Mhz. This produces a beat frequency of both 8850 to 9350 and 1450 to 950. the upper range is filtered out.
The low freq of 950 to 1450 is sent thru your switch of 950 to 2400 so it's OK for this purpose.

It should work.

[lagrange2009]

Turned out to be a bad port LNB2 on a 4 port switch. Ports LNB1 and LNB4 work fine with C-band on one and Ku on the other.

Thanks again!