locking signal

[benji]

Hi: iam just new- i have couple question about locking a signal
I have motor SG2100 with DiSEqC Mercury II receiver and Foretec 36" dish (120 cm) . Universal LNB.
Someone help me set up the dish without motor and locked on one satellite. Everything worked well. I had clear picture.
Now I am trying to set it up with the motor.
From Philadelphia, I calculated Latitude 40 , Long 75
True south = 180 + 12 = 192 My motor elavation angle is set at latitude 40. My dish angle is 24 (30-6=24).
I set up the true South at about 192 º (I used a compass to find right direction). I have set up everything following instructions the best I could.
But I am struggling locking a signal for FTA channels.
I was interested in Nimiqu , SBS, Telstar 5, Hotbird, Satmex....
Any trick I could use ??
I have SF95 signal meter.

[rainman]

Originally Posted by benji

Hi: iam just new- i have couple question about locking a signal
I have motor SG2100 with DiSEqC Mercury II receiver and Foretec 36" dish (120 cm) . Universal LNB.
Someone help me set up the dish without motor and locked on one satellite. Everything worked well. I had clear picture.
Now I am trying to set it up with the motor.
From Philadelphia, I calculated Latitude 40 , Long 75
True south = 180 + 12 = 192 My motor elavation angle is set at latitude 40. My dish angle is 24 (30-6=24).
I set up the true South at about 192 º (I used a compass to find right direction). I have set up everything following instructions the best I could.
But I am struggling locking a signal for FTA channels.
I was interested in Nimiqu , SBS, Telstar 5, Hotbird, Satmex....
Any trick I could use ??
I have SF95 signal meter.

if you have the u bolt mount on the 36" dish i would try dropping the elevation on the dish by 5 degrees these has been known to be off that much. also with your lnb you will not get much on the nimiq sat as it is a circular sat and hotbird is out of range.

[bill190]

You're doing very good to get this far!

First set the "limits" on your positioner. With some dish set-up's, it is possible to move the dish so far one direction that the dish hits the mounting pole and this damages the dish or knocks it out of alignment.

With the positioners I have seen, there are "hardware" limits and then there are "software" limits settings on the receiver. With the positioners I have seen, I would move dials on the positioner to set east/west limits, or move screw sliders for the setting. I adjust the east west limits so the dish can move as far as possible either direction without hitting anything.

Then set the high low limits on your receiver (the software limits).

So then the positioner has screws, or dials, or whatever set so the dish will only go so far east/west, and the receiver "knows" where these limits are.

Then find a satellite which is directly south which you have already done.

Next connect a signal meter at the dish. Then you want to set the "arc".
This arc needs to follow the arc where the satellites are up in space. This took me a week and a lot of patience the first time I did it. It is not easy!
Set your receiver outside so you can use the remote to make the dish move back and forth.

Adjust the dial on your signal meter so when the dish hits the south satellite, you get a reading, then when you move away from the satellite, the reading drops.

Then move the dish back and forth. With a proper setting, you will get satellites and readings moving the dish all the way east or west.
With the arc set wrong, you will just get satellites at the top of the arc - mostly when pointing south.

To adjust the arc, move the dish to the south satellite and get a reading on your meter. Then adjust the positioner arm one degree higher or lower. Then adjust the dish elevation up/down so you get the satellite signal on the south satellite again.

Now move the dish back and forth again. Do you get more satellites when moving the dish back and forth or fewer satellites? If more, you are adjusting everything the correct direction. If less, you are adjusting everything in the wrong direction - go back the other way.

Again move the dish back to the south satellite and get a reading. Then adjust.

Eventually you will get everything adjusted so you can go say a third of the way down the arc either direction and get satellites, then no more.

Next move the dish so you get the satellite the furthest east you can get a signal for. Then place your hand on the LNB and press it up/down to see if you get a higher reading on the meter. What will typically happen is that the east satellite will get a better reading if the LNB is pressed up, and the west satellite will get a better reading if the LNB is pressed down. (Or the opposite.)

What is happening at this point is that the "curve" of the arc is close to where you need it, but the arc is out of alignment with the arc of the satellites. So to adjust this, move back to the south satellite and rotate the whole positioner (pole mounting) so it faces slightly more east or west. This moves the whole arc east/west.

Then move the dish east/west and see if you get more satellites. If less, try the other direction slightly.

So there are two adjustments...

1. Curve of arc - (Adjusting the positioner arm initially to your latitude.) Adjust positioner arm up, and dish elevation down. Or down and dish elevation up. This adjusts the curve of the arc. To explain this, hold a dime in front of your eye facing south. There is a curve to the dime shape. So we could call this a narrow arc curve. Next hold a basketball in front of your face facing south. This is a wider arc curve. If you move the positioner arm up, you get a more narrow arc. If you move the positioner arm down, you get a wider arc. The arc you need will depend on your location on earth and will need to point at all of the satellites up around the equator of the earth. In my location, the arc curve is more like holding a plastic pipe in the air and the ends bend down.

2. Alignment of the dish arc to the arc of the satellites - Adjusting the positioner on the pole to move the arc more east or west. Hold that dime up again. Now move your hand a little east. You have moved the arc more east, but you still have the same curve of arc.

So basically you want to make slight adjustments so you get more and more satellites on the signal meter as you move the dish east west. The trick to this is to ALWAYS move the dish back to that south pointing satellite BEFORE making any adjustments. Then you can move the positioner arm up/down, and then move the dish elevation up/down to get that south satellite again. Or move the positioner on the pole a little and then move the dish slightly east/west and get that south satellite again.

So you always have that south satellite as a reference.

Anyway with a lot of patience and trial and error and maybe a week of making adjustments, you will be able to have the dish pointing at all satellites in the arc all the way east and west. (Note for people on the west coast, there is a gap of satellites over the pacific ocean, so won't get satellites going very far west. There is a slight gap over the atlantic ocean.)

You can check your alignment for each satellite in the arc by moving the dish so it is slightly reading the satellite, then pressing up/down on the LNB. More up or down will get a lower reading on all satellites in the arc you are dead on! Note you need to adjust the dial on the signal meter along with doing this.

Then once you get the dish perfectly aligned, you can find each satellite with your receiver and the following handy dandy frequency list I found on another satellite forum. I think you have USALS so try that first. I don't have this, so don't know how it works. But should give you a rough setting for each satellite once you find one?

Anyway each satellite has many different "frequencies". Along with each frequency is a "polarity" (H or V). And then along with this is a "symbol rate". Then there must be something being broadcast on that particular frequency to get a reading!

If you try finding a satellite using a frequency and there is nothing being broadcast on that frequency at the time, you will not find the satellite! The list below has very active frequencies for each satellite.

Anyway on your receiver, press menu, then antenna setup, then select the satellite, then select your LNB type, then select a frequency/polarity/SR from the below list. These frequencies are active and should give you a reading on the signal meter on your receiver.

Then select USALS and click OK, then I suppose goto satellite? (I don't have USALS, so don't know what to do after this???)

[For my set-up, for positioner I select DiSEqC 1.2, then click OK, then from the next menu can move the dish back and forth until I get a reading. Then use I can use step to move it back and forth a little to get the best signal.]

Strong Satellite Transponders as of April 14, 2007
Frequencies change over time and this list will become outdated eventually.

Satellite (name)-frequency/polarity/symbol rate
30 (Hispasat)-12172 H 27500 or 11935 V 2963
43 (IS-3R)-12050 H 23700
58 (PAS-9)-11612 H 3670 (Need a Universal LNB)
72 (AMC6)-12143 V 2573
74 (SBS6)-11742 H 6616
77 (G4R)-12110 V 5000 (data transponders. No active channels but strong signal)
79 (AMC5)-12182 H 23000 or 11742 V 11110
82 (Nimiq2)-12224 V 20000 (need a DBS LNB)
83 (AMC9)-12140 V 30000 or 12160 H 30000 (data transponders. No active channels but strong signal)
85 (AMC2)-12194 H 3978
87 (AMC3)-11736 V 6104 or 11716 H 4859
89 (G28 AKA IA8)-11780 H 29000
91 (G11)-12060 V 26700
93 (G26 AKA IA6)-11710 V 14320 or 11865 V 3516
95 (G3)-11780 H 20760
97 (G25 AKA IA5)-12177 V 23000 or 12152 H 20000
99 (G16 FORMERLY G4)-11760 H 30000 or 12100 V 30000 (data transponders)
101 (AMC4)-11822 H 5700 or 12120 V 30000
103 (AMC1)-12100 V 20000
105 (AMC15)-11740 H 26000 or 11840 V 26000
107.3 (AnikF1)-11902 H 5859 or 11912 H 5859
110 (Dish 110)-12224 V 20000 (a lot of transponders on this satellite are spotbeams).. (DBS LNB needed)
111.1 (AnikF2)-
113 (Satmex6)-12080 H 25635
116.8 (Satmex5)-12080 H 25635 or 11740 V 30000
119 (Dish 119)-12238 H 20000 (do not use a V transponder as the 1st 5 are spotbeams).. (DBS LNB needed)
121 (Dish 121)-12074 V 20000
123 (Galaxy 10)-11805 H 4580 or 11800 V 26660
127 (Horizon 1)-11720 H 26800
129 (G27 AKA IA7)-11964 H 2920 or use a DBS LNB and use 12457 V 20000

[bill190]

PS. On my big dish, I have adjustment screws and can adjust the dish elevation/arc very slightly with say a quarter turn of the screw.

With my small Ku dish, there is an adjustment screw for the positioner arm arc adjustment, but the dish elevation is just "losen a screw and move it up/down with your hand" type of thing.

So I drilled a couple of holes and added a "turnbuckle" to the dish for very fine adjustments. This helps to get the adjustment just right.

Here is a picture of a turnbuckle...
Vertical Antenna Guying Kits Antenna Support Turnbuckle

[rainman]

nice idea on the turnbuckle bill these small dishes can be a pain on the fine tuning.

[wejones]

My "new" trash rescued Primestar dish has a screw adjustment, but it doesn't work very smoothly. I think I'm going to hit the thing with a bunch of WD40 to clean it up, then lubricate it, because that is kind of handy.

BTW, I had mentioned days ago that my Channel Master meter wasn't working very well all of a sudden. Well I found out that I needed to charge it's battery. For some reason, I just assumed that it would work without the battery if I was using the receiver to power the lnb, but apparently it needs battery either way.

[rainman]

good to hear you got your meter figured out Bill.

[benji]

Hi billy 190
Thank you very much for all the detailed instructions. This is extremely useful and helpful.
I have been able to lockwest satellites (the first lock came after a week of hard work ) and I am now trying to lock east satellites.
I followed rainman advice about the 5 degrees and indeed mine was off by 3 degrees !! Thanks Rainman for the tip.
I'll keep you posted of my progress.
But it feel great to already have few satellites locked !!!

[rainman]

benji it is good to here you are starting to lock some sats enjoy the hobbie.