Problems with setup motorized system. Helps please!

[hpf]

Hi,

I got motorized system from sadoun 3 weeks ago and tried to set it up in the past three weeks with no success.

During the initial setup, I move my dish from true south (195.7 on compass reading) to west using USALS and found Galaxy 11 (91W) gave best signal level (~13-19%). And then I micro-adjusted my true south and dish elevation to achieve maximum signal strength (~33%). I did full power scan and were able to see more than 80 channels. These channels turned to be on IA 5 (97W) but the receiver showed as G11. I also did full power scan of other satellites but only got some channels from adjacent satellites.

I guess I had several degrees off from true south so I carefully turned my alignment towards east for several degrees. Then I got my motor to the reference (0 degree) and reset my receiver. This time I directly move my dish to IA 5 using USALS. I chose a TP which should have signal and micro-adjusted alignment. I still got very weak signal (26%) but that was the maximum strength I could get. Then I did full power scan and it turned out I got channels from AMC4 (101W). I let dish move towards IA6 (93W) and it gave me IA 5 channels. Do not think I am done (I do not mind of wrong name of satellites as long as I have channels), I can only pick up channels of satellites in 90sW. No signals from other satellites.

So something goes wrong here. I called Sadoun tech support and they did not have explanation but guess that I might have a bad receiver.

I have Fortech Lifetime Classic NA, 90mm dish, STAB HH90 motor, Invacom UNI LNBF, 5' tripod. In addition, I have compass and angle locator from Sadoun.

My position is 42.3N and 71.4W (Boston suburban). I set my motor elevation 42.3 and dish elevation 38.5.

Please help!!! I truly appreciate!

[Carpenter1]

Find your Longitude and then find the satellite that is closest to that number.
Then set that satellite up in your receiver and go to it.
This is your true south satellite.
After you have gotten signal from that one by adjusting the antenna up down and sideways got and setup another satellite that is farthest west from you and one that is farthest east.
Go to them and see if you get a signal from them (Best is if you have a meter).
If not then your mast is not plumbed up right.
You have to be plumb or all will fail.

[hpf]

Many thanks.

My Longitude is 71.4W. AMC6 (72W) is the closest one. But AMC6 has no Ku band channel.

I use angle locator for the plumb it seems right.

[Carpenter1]

That's why a meter would really help you out. You don't need to get frequency's only signal and a meter would tell you if you have a sat.

[radiobob]

Originally Posted by hpf

Many thanks.

My Longitude is 71.4W. AMC6 (72W) is the closest one. But AMC6 has no Ku band channel.

I use angle locator for the plumb it seems right.

AMC6 has a powerhouse of a Ku band channel: Gospel Broadcasting Network on 12144 V (2573 - 3/4). I get it so strong, it makes my fillings rattle.

Figuring your "true south" at about 195 degrees magnetic, I'd try setting the motor to zero, swinging the motor to 195 deg on your compass, setting your dish elevation to 38.5 degrees and your motor elevation to 42, then use USALS in your receiver to steer the dish to AMC6. Haul the receiver and TV out to the dish and make sure you're on 12144 V, then loosen the motor mount on the pole and move the entire installation dish and motor in t-i-n-y steps until your signal and quality meters on your TV reach top signal. You can then further fine-tune things by adjusting your dish elevation for best signal.

As many others told me, you've got to get the true-south sat. set up before you proceed. Also, my angle finder ended up being about 2-3 degrees off, so you might want to go get a "torpedo" level from your hardware store.

Good luck!
Bob

[elgemcdlf]

Originally Posted by hpf

Many thanks.

My Longitude is 71.4W. AMC6 (72W) is the closest one. But AMC6 has no Ku band channel.

I use angle locator for the plumb it seems right.

11726V2220 along with many others located at 72W. You should be able to see any marked Americas, Conus & while I have not tried any marked Latin America if I read the beam correctly. You receiver is moving the distance required to arrive at the sat you asked for. If you are not in the correct starting point you will not end up at the correct ending point Assuming you are using USALS.

Also many have stated they have needed to raise declination (dish elevation) roughly 5 degrees to achieve signal.

[brentb636]

You should also know that several of us, with your same dish and LNBF combination have had to add 5 or 6 degrees to the dish elevation to maximize our quality signal. I don't know the reason , but there are several possibilities.

I'm in Central Michigan and my settings should be 38.4 degrees elevation, but I had to move to about 44 degrees dish elevation to optimize my quality. Be systematic, but don't be surprised if your dish elevation has to change.

:-)

Brent

[elgemcdlf]

Originally Posted by radiobob

AMC6 has...Good luck! Bob

Bob it does my heart good to see you as a believer Just remembering all the turmoil you suffered.

[hpf]

I am sorry. I mean AMC6 does not have FTA ku band channel. But if you got Gospel Broadcasting Network (on 12144 V (2573 - 3/4) sucessfully, I should be able to use the TP to adjust my true south.

I only use Angle Locator for plumb. I might need additional tools.

Thanks!

[elgemcdlf]

Originally Posted by hpf

I am sorry. I mean AMC6 does not have FTA ku band channel. But if you got Gospel Broadcasting Network (on 12144 V (2573 - 3/4) sucessfully, I should be able to use the TP to adjust my true south.

I only use Angle Locator for plumb. I might need additional tools.

Thanks!

The Gospel Broadcasting Network is on AMC6. There is no reason as to why you can not align using the other sat located at 72 (technically 71.8). 72 is 72. You do not need to understand what they are saying on the channel only be able to receive it. 72 is loaded with Spanish language channels.

[radiobob]

Originally Posted by elgemcdlf

Bob it does my heart good to see you as a believer Just remembering all the turmoil you suffered.

Oh, yeah! And when my new (hopefully unwarped) dish comes in, I'll be even more of a believer.

Originally Posted by hpf

I only use Angle Locator for plumb. I might need additional tools.

That's what I was using my angle finder for, too. But it proved inaccurate for determining whether or not my mast was plumb. With a level you can move it around the circumference of the mast and see if the bubble moves off center.

Bob

[rainman]

I would defintely recommend a level to set you pole to plumb.

[wejones]

Originally Posted by brentb636

You should also know that several of us, with your same dish and LNBF combination have had to add 5 or 6 degrees to the dish elevation to maximize our quality signal. I don't know the reason , but there are several possibilities.
....

I'm not sure of the reason either, however about a month ago I posted a message which had the offset angles of various offset dishes, and these varied from somewhere around 20 deg to up near 30 deg if I remember right. even dishes from the same manufacturer varied by a few degrees. The reason I think this is important is that if you look at the dishes available at say Sadoun, you see that there are a couple different mounts that seem to be used with any of the dishes. Since it is the mount that has the elevation angles, to be accurate, the mount has to be matched to the offset angle of the dish, and to how the dish connects to the mount. My GUESS, and I hope Sadoun will comment, is that these mounts are not specific to the particular dish, but are generic. If the mounts sold by Sadoun are specific to one of the Fortec dishes sold by Sadoun, then it might only explain being off by a couple degrees, not 5 or 6, but if those mounts are not Fortec mounts at all, but generic, then that could explain why the readings are off so far.

HOWEVER, this is really not all that important with respect to alignment, assuming that you set the motor angle and search for your southern sat by varying this dish elevation, because the motor angle scales are definately specific to the motor, so you can trust them to be fairly accurate, and assuming that the motor angle is set properly, then the dish elevation will be set perfectly without ever looking at the scale by locating your southern sat. Of course being off by 5 degrees may make it harder to locate the southern sat, but once you find it, you'll be set right. Right enough to set and never touch again if you are careful.

Of course, there is another possible cause for angles to be off by 5 or 6 degrees, and that is that a common mistake is the confusion between elevation numbers and the "latitude" scale on motor angles. Over the years I have communicated with several people who have confused these two, and it is particularly confusing when your latitude is in the 40-45 deg range, where the numbers are similar whether you are dealing with the right number or the 90-X version. I've seen many people set their motor on like a 43 degree elevation instead of 90-43=47, because their latitude was 43, and this mistake will make your dish elevation off by 4 degrees right there. And the thing is, that even making this mistake, you will still be able to track many of the sats on one side of your arc, but not all and probably won't be able to hit things on the other side of the arc, so some people make this mistake and don't even know it.

[brentb636]

"I've seen many people set their motor on like a 43 degree elevation instead of 90-43=47, because their latitude was 43, and this mistake will make your dish elevation off by 4 degrees right there."

This sort of thing makes me dig out the manual. :-)
The STABS HH90 manual says to set the rotor elevation to latitude , and the Sadoun site installation calculator says the same thing. Are different brand motors configured differently ? I'm thinking of getting an SG2100 and I'd hate to walk into a trap.

[elgemcdlf]

Originally Posted by brentb636

"I've seen many people set their motor on like a 43 degree elevation instead of 90-43=47, because their latitude was 43, and this mistake will make your dish elevation off by 4 degrees right there."

This sort of thing makes me dig out the manual. :-)
The STABS HH90 manual says to set the rotor elevation to latitude , and the Sadoun site installation calculator says the same thing. Are different brand motors configured differently ? I'm thinking of getting an SG2100 and I'd hate to walk into a trap.

It is not a trap. I have a Sg2100 and it has dual scales. One is elevation and one is latitude. As Bill has stated when you are in the 40-50 range for both it can get a little rough if you are not paying attention. My elevation is something around 51 and my lat is 39. If I set using lat on the scale for elevation I will be way off. If I set lat on the lat scale and check the other side of the motor I will find it reads roughly 51.

I think you might be getting a bit confused with the terminology used. It could probably be worded as "Set the motor as so the indicator aligns on the scale equal to your latitude". Thus eliminating the word elevation from the statement.

Another issue you have here is Bill like myself and others have big dishes also. The terms elevation and declination are used when talking about a big dish. While the concept is the same I think we see it a bit differently than someone who is only accustom to a small dish and even more differently than someone with no dish experience and this being their first install.