What Size of Pole Needed for 1 Meter Fortec Star Dish

[jsattv]

I have a 1 meter Fortec Star Dish and HH 120 Motor on my house up on the roof right now. I'd like to re mount it on the ground about 10 feet up. I saw a post on this Forum by vj9999 dated 07- 12 -2006 under Installation Support, there is a picture there - # 3 which is exactly the type of Pole I'm looking for. Can anyone tell me: How high up the Pole is? What type of Pole is this, and what diameter it is? Is it in concrete, and where can I get one? Replies would be appreciated.

[pmb1010]

you can buy 2" schedule 40 galvanized pipe at Home Depot, in any length up to 10 feet.
Bury 3 feet will give you 7 foot pole.

If you need longer pieces, you might need to go to a plumbing supply store, and a more "industrial" one at that.
They should have schedule 40 black steel pipe in lenghts to 21 feet.
Your HH120 needs 2" to 3.5" OD pole. This type of pipe is sold sized by inner diameter - so 2" pipe is actually 2.5" on the outside.

[rainman]

I went to the local hardware store and got a 2" schedule 40 pipe used for gas lines works great it came in 12' sections if I remember right.

[vj9999]

Originally Posted by pmb1010

you can buy 2" schedule 40 galvanized pipe at Home Depot, in any length up to 10 feet.
Bury 3 feet will give you 7 foot pole.

That's where I got mine. I went just a little bit over 3' in the ground to be on the safe side so I have about 6' 1/2 above the ground. Still plenty for 120cm dish.

[jsattv]

Originally Posted by vj9999

That's where I got mine. I went just a little bit over 3' in the ground to be on the safe side so I have about 6' 1/2 above the ground. Still plenty for 120cm dish.

Thanks a lot for the replies. VJ9999 did you use fill the hole for the pipe with concrete / redicrete as well as the pipe? Or do I just need to drive the pipe into the ground?

Also I'm thinking about ordering the 120 cm dish, would it be better for digging out the hard to get Sats such as Satmex 5 than the 100 cm Fortec Star dish?

[vj9999]

I put a little bit of gravel on the bottom and filled the hole with concrete (I used quickrete - just poured it in the hole and added water). I also filled the pole with concrete to make it sturdier.

[pmb1010]

did it really need the pipe filled with concrete?
Was 7 feet really that "wiggly"?

As I struggle with my new install, I'm going to need 21 feet of pole, with a few in the ground. Filling a 2" pipe with 21 feet of concrete while standing on a roof is going to be a big chore.

[jsattv]

Originally Posted by vj9999

I put a little bit of gravel on the bottom and filled the hole with concrete (I used quickrete - just poured it in the hole and added water). I also filled the pole with concrete to make it sturdier.

Thanks VJ9999, went to Home Depot today and they had 2 types of - 2 inch diameter Poles: a 12 Foot Heavy Guage Rigid Pole - $74.00, and a 10 foot EMT pole - $65.00. The 12 foot pole is real heavy and I would need help transporting it. I am favouring the 12 Foot since everyone up here in Winnipeg, Canada (150 miles North of Grand Forks, ND), says our frost line goes well below 3 feet. We can get to 40 degrees below zero in Jan and Feb. So the 12 Foot would likely need to go in at least 4 feet. And I'll use gravel and the readycrete you suggested for the hole and fill the pipe.

One question: How do you set up if the Dish and Motor get out of calibration say from a heavy windstorm? That is, up on the roof I take up a small TV and the Sat Receiver to reset it up, with everything close by the Dish. But with the Dish up approx 6 -7 feet above the ground, I'm thinking I'd need some type of table or platform to recalibrate the Dish! Or maybe purchase an expensive Birddog or Sathawk Meter? Any replies would be much appreciated.

[pmb1010]

Think of a 50mph wind, as your car travelling down the road at 50mph.
Now hold your dish out the car window. Thats the wind load it will see.

Don't use the EMT. Get the heavier pipe. Yeah its 75 bucks but you'll know it's stable.

Yes make sure you go under the frost line. If the frost line is 36 inches go 4 more for 40 total. The last thing you want is the thing moving and heaving out of the ground...

Maybe with the dish closer to the ground it wont be blown out of alignment as much with a strong mount system. I use a picnic table I drag over. Or dont mount it at 7, mount at 5 make it easier.

[rainman]

Originally Posted by pmb1010

did it really need the pipe filled with concrete?
Was 7 feet really that "wiggly"?

As I struggle with my new install, I'm going to need 21 feet of pole, with a few in the ground. Filling a 2" pipe with 21 feet of concrete while standing on a roof is going to be a big chore.

If I was going that high PMB I would also brace the pole to the house.

[vj9999]

Originally Posted by pmb1010

did it really need the pipe filled with concrete?
Was 7 feet really that "wiggly"?

As I struggle with my new install, I'm going to need 21 feet of pole, with a few in the ground. Filling a 2" pipe with 21 feet of concrete while standing on a roof is going to be a big chore.

Honestly not sure how wiggly it would have been I read that alot of people were doing it so I did it to be on the safe side. I have 120cm dish on it and when winds pick up it's like a big sail.

I also made the bottom of the hole a little bit wider, cut the bottom of the pipe in a 45 degree angle and drilled 2 holes and added 2 rods through the pipe to prevent any twisting and turning. It's been looking good for couple of years now.

I will shamefully admit that I have not plugged in my receivers in almost a year now since last summer. I just haven't had time and I lost my "office" where all my stuff was since we had to convert it to a baby room

[pmb1010]

Originally Posted by rainman

If I was going that high PMB I would also brace the pole to the house.

it is... current pole is 3" emt 21 feet, with 120cm dish and HH120 on it.
It's standing on a hardened steel 3 foot pin, and braced to the house with 2 saddle clamps at the 10 foot mark (about halfway).
120cm is mounted at 15 foot mark.
At the very top is some guy wires that anchor the top of pole for added stability in 2 directions.

If I put the new 6 foot dish at this spot, I'll need to rethink things as I lose the top guy wires because H180 motor mounts on top of the pole.

[wejones]

I'm curious whether anyone here has actually compared the flex of a pole before and after adding concrete. Intuitively it sounds like it should make the pole more rigid, but I really wonder just how much improvement you can expect. I also wonder how much of the observed "flex" in these poles is actually the whole pole moving a bit.
But yeah, filling a 21' x 2" pole seems like a waste of time. I assume the plan was already like Rainman said, ie to attach to a building. I've only seen one dish mounted on a 21' pole free standing, and it was a heavy ~11' dish at that, and it boggles my mind how that can work, even if filled with concrete. Plus it would really make routine alignment an adventure.

And re the heavy Sched 40 pipe being sold by ID, and the OD really being 2.5", as mentioned above. That's what I used to think, but it's actually more complicated. It's actually sold by something called "Nominal Size", which ends up with the ID being close to that size for sched 40, but not exactly. The OD of 2" pipe is actually 2.375", and the wall thickness varies for different schedules. For sched 40, the ID is 2.067, ie very close to the 2", but not exactly, and for other schedules it varies between 1" and 2.345". So it isn't really sold by ID, it's just that the ID of sched 40 is usually close to the nominal size. The only fixed size of these scheduled pipes is the OD.... I have no idea of the logic behind any of this.

[pmb1010]

Originally Posted by wejones

ie to attach to a building.... the ID is 2.067

yes it will be if I do it the same way. If I cut the offending tree down, it's a whole different issue.

and regarding pipe diameters & stuff, I just wanted the guy to know the approximate sizes so he doesn't get one that won't fit the bracket on the motor. I think the same guy that thought up nominal pipe sizes also did shotgun gauges, and wire gauges too - simply to confuse everyone.

[jsattv]

Originally Posted by vj9999

Honestly not sure how wiggly it would have been I read that alot of people were doing it so I did it to be on the safe side. I have 120cm dish on it and when winds pick up it's like a big sail.

I also made the bottom of the hole a little bit wider, cut the bottom of the pipe in a 45 degree angle and drilled 2 holes and added 2 rods through the pipe to prevent any twisting and turning. It's been looking good for couple of years now.

I will shamefully admit that I have not plugged in my receivers in almost a year now since last summer. I just haven't had time and I lost my "office" where all my stuff was since we had to convert it to a baby room

Thanks a lot for the useful info guys. So I guess the 12 foot 2 inch Rigid Pole for my HH120 Motor and 120 cm Fortec Dish is the way to go,- likely buried about 4 - 5 feet deep.

Also vj9999 what type of LNB is that you have pictured in your post from 07-12-2006? I currently have a Invacom QPH-031, is the unit you show good for BOTH C & KU Band Sats? Is it better than the Invacom?

[pmb1010]

Hey jsattv,

I hope you dont mind us all chatting together like this. Happens a lot here.

I can answer some of the questions. I have the same setup as VJ9999.
It's a 120cm offset Fortec dish, and on it is a BSC-621-2 C/Ku band LNBF.
It's not necessarily "better" than the Invacom. I got similar results from Invacom Ku LNBF on 33 inch dish as I get from BSC-621-2 on a 4 foot dish.

Yes it receives both C and Ku signals. But be advised it is a compromise setup. You can only get the strongest of C band signals, some quite well in fact. Its a "fun dish" to try to fool around with. By no means consider it a C band production dish. You really need 8 to 10 foot to make it work right. I'm putting up 6 foot prime focus to replace 4 footer to do a little better.

If you already have a HH120, the max you can go is 120cm.
You will also need a conicar Scalar assembly for offset dish, Sadoun said he was going C-Band LNBF LNB C/KU combination to carry them, but it still showed "on order" for a while now: