C-Band Wiring Help

[messinwu]

Hey Everyone

I am not new to setting up dishes, but I am brand new to C-Band. I know there are wild feeds up there and I want them, especially the HD ones, since I have an HD FTA receiver.

Anyway, I have ordered the FS6P (6' C/Ku Dish w/Polar Mount), HARL-3618 actuator, BSC621-2 C/Ku LNBF, and a V3000 GBox positioner. It will be here tomorrow. Yesterday I rented an auger and dug a 42" hole, bought an 8' (3" diameter) pole and cemented it in last night. It's ready for a dish now, perfectly plumb.

Anyway, today I want to run some coax from the dish to my receiver area. But, I can't find anywhere that explains how the positioner is wired to the actuator. I've read about a C-Band ribbon cable, etc. I have RG-6 and compression ends coming out of my behind, so that's not an issue. My thought was that I'll just run two RG6's to the site, one for signal and the other for powering the actuator motor? It this right for the above-listed equipment? I would think so, but I'm not sure if there's extra wires needed, etc. I have a Ku H-H motor set up too, which uses the same coax for everything, so there lies my confusion I guess.

Can someone tell me what wires I should run out there today so it's ready for a dish tomorrow after assembly?

Thanks in advance!!

[pmb1010]

It all depends on your Vbox and Actuator.

I have HH180 motor, and am using a DSC920 receiver to move it.

Requires 4 wires, 2 hefty ones for 36v motor power, and 2 smaller ones for the positioner sensor. (that would be the ribbon cable wires of which you mentioned). I would suspect your's is the same.

Since my install is temporary, I got cheap and used some Cat 5 cable I swiped from work. It is 8 conductor, I twisted 2 sets of 3 for the power cable, and used the last 2 for sensor. About 50 feet. Its working.

[lumpkin666]

The actuator will need 4 wires going to it from the vBox (in addition to the RG6 that goes from the vBox to the lnb). 2 Wires go to the sensor to tell the vBox that the actuator is moving, and 2 wires go to the positive and negative terminals to supply power to the actuator to move it.

[wejones]

Originally Posted by messinwu

Hey Everyone

I am not new to setting up dishes, but I am brand new to C-Band. I know there are wild feeds up there and I want them, especially the HD ones, since I have an HD FTA receiver.

Anyway, I have ordered the FS6P (6' C/Ku Dish w/Polar Mount), HARL-3618 actuator, BSC621-2 C/Ku LNBF, and a V3000 GBox positioner. It will be here tomorrow. Yesterday I rented an auger and dug a 42" hole, bought an 8' (3" diameter) pole and cemented it in last night. It's ready for a dish now, perfectly plumb.

Anyway, today I want to run some coax from the dish to my receiver area. But, I can't find anywhere that explains how the positioner is wired to the actuator. I've read about a C-Band ribbon cable, etc. I have RG-6 and compression ends coming out of my behind, so that's not an issue. My thought was that I'll just run two RG6's to the site, one for signal and the other for powering the actuator motor? It this right for the above-listed equipment? I would think so, but I'm not sure if there's extra wires needed, etc. I have a Ku H-H motor set up too, which uses the same coax for everything, so there lies my confusion I guess.

Can someone tell me what wires I should run out there today so it's ready for a dish tomorrow after assembly?

Thanks in advance!!

Any time you use an actuator or non-DiseqC1.2 H-H motor, you are going to need two heavy guage and 2 light guage wires going out to the dish, in addition to the coax that goes to the lnbf. The heavy guage wires are for the actuator motor, and the light guage wires go to the reed switch. Some actuators might need 3 light guage wires, but most only need 2.

Basically, the coax from the receiver goes to the VBOX thing, and from the vbox, a coax and the 4 wires go to the dish. Ribbon cable usually has 2 coaxes, the 2 heavy and 3 light guage wires described above, plus 3 wires for a polarotor, which you won't have. Ribbon cable is very comvenient, but it is expensive. I'm not sure what guage heavy guage is requirred, but I'm guessing that it is about 14 gua, but that's just a guess. I'm sure it depends a bit on how long the run is, and lighter guage will work, but the motor will run slower.

BTW, by choosing the 621-2 lnbf, you'll be ruling out some analog/dcii on Ku, but it will be OK for DVB, plus it will give you low band Ku, so it's a tradeoff.

[1captain]

Originally Posted by messinwu

Hey Everyone

I am not new to setting up dishes, but I am brand new to C-Band. I know there are wild feeds up there and I want them, especially the HD ones, since I have an HD FTA receiver.

Anyway, I have ordered the FS6P (6' C/Ku Dish w/Polar Mount), HARL-3618 actuator, BSC621-2 C/Ku LNBF, and a V3000 GBox positioner. It will be here tomorrow. Yesterday I rented an auger and dug a 42" hole, bought an 8' (3" diameter) pole and cemented it in last night. It's ready for a dish now, perfectly plumb.

Anyway, today I want to run some coax from the dish to my receiver area. But, I can't find anywhere that explains how the positioner is wired to the actuator. I've read about a C-Band ribbon cable, etc. I have RG-6 and compression ends coming out of my behind, so that's not an issue. My thought was that I'll just run two RG6's to the site, one for signal and the other for powering the actuator motor? It this right for the above-listed equipment? I would think so, but I'm not sure if there's extra wires needed, etc. I have a Ku H-H motor set up too, which uses the same coax for everything, so there lies my confusion I guess.

Can someone tell me what wires I should run out there today so it's ready for a dish tomorrow after assembly?

Thanks in advance!!

1st i would call some of youre local satellite dealers that deal with c-band to get the ribbon cable it will make youre job lot easyer, because that cabl has sheilded wiring for the sensor, you can use a 8-conductor (rotor cable will work but not recomended). now for your wiring to the motor 4 wires 2for motor up and down at least 14 gage and 2 for the read switch 16to18 gage , and if you are going to work a servo you will need 3-more wires up to the c&ku feed, but if you are using lnb-f you dont need the 3 wires up in the feed, hope all helps

[messinwu]

Hmm, well THANK YOU all for your responses. The dish is on the side of my house next to the attached garage. So maybe it would be feasible to have the GBOX located inside the garage so those four cables only have a short distance to run, and the signal cable will run all the way to the other side of my house to the receiver. So when I need to move the dish, I'd go out to the garage. Is that practical? I mean, not having it connected to any receiver? Or will that not work at all?

Basically, I don't want to buy a ribbon cable since I already have so much RG6. But what I'm understanding is that I would need four wires going to the VBOX and then my usual coax to the LNB, correct? I have quite a bit of CAT5 cable as well, so I think perhaps I could run the whole distance with that for the VBOX to positioner connections. I would never have thought of that!

All of my equipment is DVB, so I think I should be okay with the LNB I ordered, at least for now. I found some pretty good tutorials online of how to set up the polar mount to be aimed correctly, looks like it's best to start out calibrating on Ku satellites. I think I'll start on 97w.

[wejones]

Originally Posted by messinwu

Hmm, well THANK YOU all for your responses. The dish is on the side of my house next to the attached garage. So maybe it would be feasible to have the GBOX located inside the garage so those four cables only have a short distance to run, and the signal cable will run all the way to the other side of my house to the receiver. So when I need to move the dish, I'd go out to the garage. Is that practical? I mean, not having it connected to any receiver? Or will that not work at all?
...

I think that should work fine, and you wouldn't have to go out to the garage to move the dish, because your receiver will give the VBOX DiseqC commands through the coax, then the VBOX converts that to the DC power to run the motor.

[rainman]

Originally Posted by messinwu

Hmm, well THANK YOU all for your responses. The dish is on the side of my house next to the attached garage. So maybe it would be feasible to have the GBOX located inside the garage so those four cables only have a short distance to run, and the signal cable will run all the way to the other side of my house to the receiver. So when I need to move the dish, I'd go out to the garage. Is that practical? I mean, not having it connected to any receiver? Or will that not work at all?

Basically, I don't want to buy a ribbon cable since I already have so much RG6. But what I'm understanding is that I would need four wires going to the VBOX and then my usual coax to the LNB, correct? I have quite a bit of CAT5 cable as well, so I think perhaps I could run the whole distance with that for the VBOX to positioner connections. I would never have thought of that!

All of my equipment is DVB, so I think I should be okay with the LNB I ordered, at least for now. I found some pretty good tutorials online of how to set up the polar mount to be aimed correctly, looks like it's best to start out calibrating on Ku satellites. I think I'll start on 97w.

there is a place wher you can buy just the motor wire all packaged in one conduit. PM me and I will let you know where I got mine.I think it was around 39 cents per foot.

[messinwu]

I think I'll just go with the CAT5 cable for now, until it proves to be no longer worthy or whatever.

Hey, one more question (I hope!). I see th LNB I bought has its own integrated switch on the side with a pigtail for going into the end of the LNB for Ku band. It says port A would be C band and port B would be Ku band hooked up this way. Well, I'm planning on connecting the dish to port 4 of an already in place diseqc switch, then have a 22KHz on/off switch at the dish itself. What if I just connect one port of my 22KHz switch to the "RCV" port on the integrated switch, which was to be C Band on port 1 normally, then the other port of my 22KHz to the end of the LNB, which should give me Ku band from the LNB?

I know some of you guys are pretty darned advanced, so any thoughts? Seems like it should work. I know it's a waste having a switch there already, but it won't work with my existing switch as you can see. 22KHz tone can be passed through a diseqc port, but not other diseqc commands, at least with my switch I'm using...

[pmb1010]

please be advised when I gave you that idea for CAT5, I also gave you my equipment in use.
Your actuator might draw much more current then my motor, and please don't come back and say you had issues and troubles because of it.

They use the heavier wire for a reason. There could be potential for a fire if using too light a gauge of wire.

Putting very low amp fuses in both motor lines might be well advised. You would need to calculate the amp capacity of how many CAT5 wires in use, and be below that value.

[messinwu]

pmb1010 - thank you for the heads-up, you have a valid point. However, I am a risk-taker. They both run on 36 volts and are designed for the same size dish, just different mechanisms. I couldn't find the amp consumption of my actuator compared to what yours uses, but I'm thinking it should be comparable. Don't worry, I won't hold it against you if it doesn't work or gives me problems. I'll post back here to let everyone know of my success or failure, so that others will know in the future if CAT5 is feasible for this configuration.

[wejones]

Originally Posted by messinwu

....

Hey, one more question (I hope!). I see th LNB I bought has its own integrated switch on the side with a pigtail for going into the end of the LNB for Ku band. It says port A would be C band and port B would be Ku band hooked up this way. Well, I'm planning on connecting the dish to port 4 of an already in place diseqc switch, then have a 22KHz on/off switch at the dish itself. What if I just connect one port of my 22KHz switch to the "RCV" port on the integrated switch, which was to be C Band on port 1 normally, then the other port of my 22KHz to the end of the LNB, which should give me Ku band from the LNB?

I know some of you guys are pretty darned advanced, so any thoughts? Seems like it should work. I know it's a waste having a switch there already, but it won't work with my existing switch as you can see. 22KHz tone can be passed through a diseqc port, but not other diseqc commands, at least with my switch I'm using...

Hope I get this one right... last time I responded to a 621-2 post, I had things backward.

I think that the internal switch in the 621-2 is a DiseqC, because it needs 22KHz for the universal Ku lnbf. Because of this, I think that what your're proposing will be very tricky, assuming I understand what you're saying. I'm not sure whether you're talking about using the pigtail, and runing the receiver port on the lnbf to port 4 on another switch, or running separate C and Ku lines to two different ports on the 4 port switch or runing separate C and Ku lines to two ports of a 22KHz switch, then running that too port 4 on the Diseqc? I think that you're saying the latter. However each has it's problems. The first one won't work because you'd have to be sending diseqC 1 or 2 to choose C or Ku, at the same time you send DiseqC 4 for your 4 port switch. The third option has problems because you need 22KHz to choose upper/lower band on the Ku port, so it seems like you'd be stuck only getting the upper half of the Ku, plus, unless you can somehow get DiseqC port 1 command to the lnbf, there isn't a way to select the C band side of the lnbf, because there doesn't seem to be a way to bypass the internal diseqc switch for C-band. The second option seems to be the only one that has a chance. Ie, if you ran the C-band side of the lnbf into port 1 of your 4 port switch -AND-, -IF-your 4 port switch passes DiseqC signals, and then bypass the pigtail and run the Ku side to any other port on the 4 port switch, then this might just work. Ie the diseqc port 1 signal might select both port 1 on the 4 port switch AND select C-band on the lnbf. However there's also a chance that it wouldn't work, depending on how well the 4 port passes the diseqc commands.
What you're proposing would be much easier (I think) if you had the 621 instead of the 621-2, because that uses 22khz in the lnbf, so you could use the pigtail and run to port 4 like you say, and that should work.... but you don't have the 621, so you may have problems.

[messinwu]

In my past experience (I'm no expert!), a switch is EITHER diseqc OR 22KHz, not both as you've indicated. However, I did not try what I proposed at all, I just ran a CAT5 cable along with my single coax a separate feed into the house and I'll switch cables into the receiver when I want to view something on the big dish.

Yep, I got my 6' prime focus working and tuned in C-Band frequencies for the first time ever. It was cool. I had a heck of a time setting the whole thing up though, because I bought 3" pipe, but apparently that was Inside Diameter and not Outside as the mount needs, have no idea where you'd get true 3" OD pipe. Anyway, it was already cemented into the ground, so I ended up getting a 4' piece of 2.5" pipe (slightly larger than that on the outside diameter) and used U-Bolts to clamp it to the side of the bigger pole. It took a while and it's VERY tight, very rock solid and holds the dish (only about 75 lbs) very nicely. I was worried there for a bit though!

Then I had trouble finding my southern bird because of two things. First, the actual LNB focal point is VERY picky, a milimeter off or so and you have no signal, period. Plus, I thought there would be markings for elevation on the mount, but no such luck. I ended up buying an angle meter that got me a lot closer to actually tune something, then once I figured out what bird I was on, I got things lined up.

Also, one would think the instructions for assembly would include Step 1, Step 2, etc. for the Fortec FC06-P dish, but no such luck there either. No instructions at all whatsoever. Just the same exploded schematic that is included on the Sadoun website. I got it together, though. Works very well!

[wejones]

Originally Posted by messinwu

In my past experience (I'm no expert!), a switch is EITHER diseqc OR 22KHz, not both as you've indicated. ....

Hi
I'm confused re what you mean above. I don't think that anything said that DiseqC switches were the same as 22KHz switches. I think there is some mis-interpretation of what was said, but I'm not sure where.
Although slightly off topic, the DiseqC switches do actually use 22KHz. The diseqc commands are modulated on a 22KHz carrier, but after the signal is sent the carrier is removed if the receiver isn't sending out a 22khz signal for other reasons. But as you say 22khz switches are different from diseqC switches.

Originally Posted by messinwu

Yep, I got my 6' prime focus working and tuned in C-Band frequencies for the first time ever. It was cool. I had a heck of a time setting the whole thing up though, because I bought 3" pipe, but apparently that was Inside Diameter and not Outside as the mount needs, have no idea where you'd get true 3" OD pipe. Anyway, it was already cemented into the ground, so I ended up getting a 4' piece of 2.5" pipe (slightly larger than that on the outside diameter) and used U-Bolts to clamp it to the side of the bigger pole. It took a while and it's VERY tight, very rock solid and holds the dish (only about 75 lbs) very nicely. I was worried there for a bit though!
...

I assume this wasn't possible due to the particular type of pipe you boug